Accel does not have such a rotor so even more cumbersome methods must be undertaken to get the rotor phased correctly. Yes, certain very specific constraints need to be met. New Sniper install with dual-sync distributor won't run. Others, including some very bright mechanical minds, have spent countless hours trying to implement other solutions only to give up in frustration.If you do go another route, I encourage you to come back here when you finish and let us know if you succeeded or if you burned through 100 hours of your life only to end up with a solution that "only occasionally stalls." Ken says he reloaded the setup a couple of times and the problem went away and everything runs great now. Leave absolutely as much in place as possible when installing the Sniper and see if you still get spark when you crank. Patreon link: https://www.patreon.com/HoneybadgerOBSPayPal:[email protected] Thank you to 918 Motorsports!! The dual-sync 10-pin connector will simply plug into the 10-pin ignition harness that is available on the universal (non-LS Specific) Terminator EFI systems. I'm close to getting a Sniper for a '73 Dodge RV with a remanufactured 360 and the original Chysler electronic ignition. I have purchased a hyperspark distributor since my original post and did not have a single problem until a month later. Please tell me if you think this will work as I can’t see any other options for my project to work. I would think it would useful information. Second--backfiring through the crankcase? Usually this will produce some pretty nasty results (backfiring, kickback, etc.) At lease one has. I have learned to never say never to ignition setups. However, I will leave you with the advice an old friend gave me when I was building my first stock-class circle-track race car. Free ground shipping regardless of order size! The only thing im not getting Sniper is the Ignition box since I already have one (MSD 6A). Set up wizard check. Find a lower price anywhere and we'll beat it by 5%! Because I didn't have a clue on this I emailed Ken directly and got a few more details. I highly recommend using the Holley dual-sync distributor instead. The Coil Driver Module has 4 wires. Perhaps I'm over simplifying it, but isn't the pro billet just a fancy gutted small cap HEI that's easily locked out? )I would not let your Sniper EFI Upgrade plans get put off track by the ignition issue, however. That is where it gets a bit tricky.How you do this is really irrelevant--which is why I avoid saying "that won't work." I generally respond within one business day. This is the power for the module. I would say it happens more often sitting still or at low speed but it’s made things interesting at highway speeds as well which in a car wouldn’t be terrible but the setup is in an 86 CJ7. I wish there was a pattern or specific environment as to when the unit resets, but sometimes it happens immediately and then there’s times where I might drive an hour before I get the dreaded stall. There is a model available for the Chrysler 360. Compared to the first two methods this requires significantly more engineering, so proceed completely as your own risk. I’ve got my Terminator X Max setup wired into my 2006 LQ4 (from a Suburban 2500) in my 1983 GMC 2500. It will work on a Terminator EFI System because that system does provide the required SPOUT signal but not on a Sniper EFI System. I came here for advice if I should keep my MSD box or just fork out the money and get the whole hyperspark system. Or is there a benefit to having the module remain that I don't understand? There are some rare cases when I might make that recommendation but yours is not one of them. It works flawlessly triggering a battle-hardened ignition system but when connected to more sensitive electronics it leaves the potential for issues. Either way, if you buy it here I'll be eager to help you every step of the way. Use the purple wire with the included extension wire) and connect that not to the distributor tach out but to the tach out on the CD box. Here are the configuration settings you'll need to use when using the HyperSpark Distributor with your Terminator Ignition System: Terminator Ignition Wiring with Holley Dual Sync Distributor. A bit odd. But I recognize Knowing that, you can follow these steps to do a quick sanity check on your ignition. I always recommend using battery-power via an ignition-switched relay for all of your sensitive electronics. Can someone please help me understand? As I've said before on this post, I never say never when it comes to ignition setups. With the advance locked out, the rotor phasing kit allows you to manually set the position of the rotor to the correct location. But, in this case, that best bang is the dual-sync distributor.If you want to go another route then I think that my article, above, provides enough basic direction to get you on the right path. Use your best judgement and do what seems right for you. First, I can't tell you how (so I'd be a blind guide.). I have recently purchased a super sniper 4500 and I have a question about, how can I use my MSD 7AL-3 and have the sniper parameters control all aspects of my timing. (Cumbersome--not impossible. And I suspect it will start just fine as soon as you resolve the problem in your non-EFI controlled ignition system. Instead, use the included purple wire adapter and hook it to the tach output of the MSD box. I'm planning on getting the Sniper EFI, Sniper Hyperspark distributor, and Sniper Hyperspark Coil. Don't get me wrong, I'm all about doing things in a cost effective way and am always looking for the best bang-for-your-buck. A complete mystery. Just like when using an MSD distributor with the Sniper, the included coil driver module or a CD box must be used. Customer service is top-notch. Are you really sure you need to do Sniper EFI-controlled ignition right now?Here's the reason I'm asking. Why can't you LSx guys just wire your crank & cam sensors exactly as shown in the Holley EFI Wiring Manual? Pardon me for answering your good question with another question of my own. go forward with that assumption.You've not yet seen this new video from Holley. Two powertrain management systems from Holley that offer plug and play control for most small block Ford engines including Coyote engines starting at just $999. Demystifying Holley Terminator and Sniper Ignition Hookup. going to 12v ignition, and a separate 12v ignition going to the coil. Connect the yellow wire from the 7-pin harness to the tach out and you are done. Looking at installing a Holley Sniper EFI unit on my 67 Corvette and interested in timing control. If you want to try to stick with the magnetic pickup then make sure the wires are tightly twisted and you might even consider shielding them. Sounds like a good plan, Jay. This can be done with or without a capacitive discharge box. Since you're still in the homework phase, I would add that if you have an electronically-controlled transmission in your '95, that is going to be another challenge you will face. I would love to hear your comments or questions, so please post them below. First thing I was instructed to do was a TPS Autoset. On my truck I have a small 4-position mini fuse panel that is battery powered through a 30-amp relay. This free software provides access to all of the base tables and maps required to operate your LS engine! If you follow these instructions you can set the ignition configuration as follows: I do not recommend Sniper ignition control using the MSD distributor if a Holley HyperSpark or Dual-Sync Distributor is available for your application. Would the Accel 77110 distributor be an option or should I just look at a MSD tach drive distributor? Why settle for a junkyard ECU with a cumbersome aftermarket tuning interface when you can get complete control of your engine, self-learning fuel strategies and the proven, race winning technology of Holley EFI for under a grand! Yes, there are some big benefits to Sniper EFI-controlled ignition timing. In that case you'd have to replace the box anyway. If so then that implies that any problems that are generated are a result of the implementation of the ProBillet as a source of both crank trigger and spark distribution. It is entirely likely that the 5- and 7- pin versions can be used as well but that is beyond the scope of this article. In addition to this, you need to lock out the mechanical and vacuum advance (as is done in the MSD method, above.) Now, you already have a connector, but on that page are a picture of the connector as well as a list of the various signals and the pin letter into which they go. Update:  Recently, Ian of TurboCamaro.CA created this AMAZING VIDEO of his success setting up the GM Large Cap HEI distributor to do Sniper EFI System ignition control. Terminator X EFI. It packs a nice punch plus it's e-core design tends to resist breakdown and RFI much better than cannister-style coils. Personally, I would not only lock out the distributor but would gut the magnetic pickup entirely and install a hall-effect pickup but you're starting to run into a bit of money again. I'm still confused on one thing you said.. "Any of the Holley EFI Systems can be operated with or without the ECU controlling the ignition. It's not clear to me how they are connected, or what the function is. If you've had any experience with this please do add your comments! Is that the case? If you are not getting spark then there is a problem with your HyperSpark configuration in the Sniper EFI System. handy ignition testing technique for point-output controlled systems. Let me start with the easy answer--there is no direct benefit to purchasing the Dual-Sync over the HyperSpark distributor for the Sniper EFI System. We know this does work, and it can save you a few hundred bucks, but I still believe that the large majority of folks out there are better served to use the Holley Dual-Sync Distributor. Good luck--you're going to need it! But here is another issue: Those "misfires" generated by the stumble are going to be read as dead lean pulses, and the Sniper is going to respond by throwing fuel at it. The fuel feed is on the drivers side, the return is coming out of the regulated side And it will work great with the Terminator EFI Throttle Body Injection System. Yes, the MSD distributor is one of the two options for doing timing control on a Sniper EFI System but not all MSD distributors are included in that. GM offered these wtih 4-, 5-, and 7-pin modules. One of the huge benefits of the HyperSpark system is the plug-and-play simplicity of installing an ignition system that already has all of the connectors designed to be mated together. If you look at them you will see they have the same 2-wire connector that will mate to the green-purple harness on the Sniper EFI System.It is my experience that you can buy the MSD Pro-Billet distributor for your application and add the required rotor rephasing kit and still be about $80 or so under what you would pay for the Holley DSD and adapter harness. Now, if you are relegated to using the TFI ignition that came with your factory EFI then you still might have a chance of it working, but it might require that you leave your factory ECU in place. If a capacitive discharge ignition box is used, then the points output generated by the electronically-controlled distributor will trigger the box to produce the spark ad the ECU-determined timing. If so, then the shift assist module will have no ill effect on the could driver.One other question, could the could driver be used with the hyper spark distributer? I have read a few places that it is possible to use a Ford TFI distributor by modifying the shutter wheel to have 8 equally sized shutters and adjusting the pickup location to match the input in crank trigger offset (i.e. This should work well for you. Basically I’m not getting any. Why settle for a junkyard ECU with a cumbersome aftermarket tuning interface when you can take complete control of your engine with easy to use self-learning fueling strategies and the proven, race winning technology of Holley EFI. It seems pretty easy since it all connects together with plugs. Any light you can shed on this would be great. Whether you are building a budget beater or a boosted race car, Terminator X has the features and technology you need at a price that won’t break the bank! Some have found that 0.65v is a more appropriate MSV, and some also prefer to increase the filtering on this to "High". of the Dual Sync distributor. This is a timing issue. I’m trying to make sense of the LS1 vs LS2 wiring diagrams. Holley Terminator X Max Bundle for LS1 w/o 3.5" Handheld GM LS 24x Crank, 1x Cam - LS1/LS6 Engines - 4L60E/4L80E Transmission Control, No Laptop Required, USB/CAN Tuning Cable $1334.00 120-00067 You can certainly choose to continue to control the ignition timing using the MSD 7AL-3. While getting the rotor phased correctely is still an issue with the Terminator it is not as sensitive to RFI as the Sniper ECU so that half of the problem goes away. 92 Mustang LX 347 11:1 TEA 205cc Twisted Wedge, FTI cam, Ported Victor 5.0, Holley Terminator X … I put the Mallory back in and it runs great. Take control of your LS engine with Terminator X! As you can see from the datalog below, I'm getting RPM signal during cranking, but the signal drops to zero and Diag #6 error count increases at that time. When it comes to ignitions there are so very many different things that can be done that it is entirely likely that there is a way to make this work. Just like when using the points output with the Terminator, a coil driver module must be used between the ECU Points output and the COIL (-) if a CD box is not used. You're not actually using the module, you are just picking up the signals you need at these points. & Hyfire (using the Hyfire tach output for the ECU) due to the former expense If you use the Coil Near Plug Smart Coil Kit and the HP Smart Coil Harness to Holley EFI Main Harness Adapter then you can implement a coil-per-plug ignition on your Buick 455. Do I need to keep these relays? The mechanical advance is merely a function of RPM. Thanks for the quick reply! Copyright © 2017 Cyberspace Automotive Performance, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Never say never. I'm even more interested in the HyperSpark. Good news! This is necessary because if one tried to detail all of the different ways to implement the ignition on a given EFI system it would simply be more confusing than helpful. We offer a harness (PN ESP TERM2HS) that reduces the number of manual terminations to only one--LESS required by the Sniper! Or you could use the 7AL-3 simply to provide capacitive discharge and protect your Sniper's points output from flyback voltage generated by the coil. https://www.tempest-racing.com/ Holley does not make a tach drive dual-sync distributor as far as I can tell. Thank you, Chris! Because of that, it can be used to control timing on a GM Small Cap HEI or Ford TFI distributor. I had not touched, programmed or made any changes what so ever in at least 2-3 weeks. That means that any ignition you can implement with the Sniper can also be implemented with the Termaintor. Like with the Sniper, the white Points Output wire is used to ground the coil through either the Holley Coil Driver Module (PN 556-150) or a capacitive ignition box (like the HyperSpark or MSD 6EFI) and distributed using the Holley HyperSpark Disstributor or Holley Dual-Sync Distributor. You will need to tune these values. With a sniper efi coil? Two powertrain management systems from Holley that offer plug and play control for most domestic V8 engines starting at just $999. I suspect you know that but I just wanted to make sure that was clear up front.Beyond that, I have learned never to say "no way" when it comes to Sniper ECU timing-controlled ignition setups. However, there is still one unanswered question I have.The boat has a shift assist circuit that essentially “stumbles” the engine by keeping the negative coil I out grounded for every other firing pulse. :-). GM Drive-by Wire Throttle Body Control (Terminator X Max Only) GM Transmission Control (Terminator X Max Only) Genuine Bosch LSU 4.9 Wideband Control (Will not work with LSU 4.2 Oxygen Sensors) On-Board Diagnostic LEDS for: ECU Power – Engine Run – Wideband Status – TPS Calibration – Crank Signal – Cam Signal. If the 24x reluctor is still turning with the crankshaft, and the sensor air gap is within specification, the sensor should transmit a signal. The 4-pin module has connectors labled B, C, W, and G. Attach them as follows: I have heard that sometimes it is necessary to reverse the purple and green wires on some distributors. I hope that nothing I said gave that impression--My apologies if so! Yes, that's even a few dollars more than the MSD route. So you can go with either the MSD Box or just use the included coil driver, as you prefer!I would go on to say that I don't usually recommend doing both the fuel and ignition setup at once on the Sniper EFI System. all directions; out the exhaust, through the throttle body, and through the crank As mentioned above, even those who have the MSD distributor and the available rotor phasing kit have enough problems that I simply no longer recommend it for most.Let me be careful not to imply that ECU-controlled ignition timing with your existing ignition is not possible. I encourage you to carefully consider the costs. All I can see is that if I use my 7AL-3 I have to select no timing control by the sniper. 27,512. Would it be much harder to wire all that up to the MSD? EFI Systems based on Holley's world-class Dominator and HP ECU's. Once installed as shown above, the Sniper EFI System should be configured as follows,  This is done either using the setup wizard (if doing a new installation) or using the handheld tuning capabilities (navigate to Tuning > Advanced > Adv. I expect that you're going to find both increased performance and economy (which are both generally in short supply in RV's! This method requires that you get a GM Large Cap HEI distributor with the 4-pin module in it. You may want to record & review a short System Log of you skimming a piece of metal across the cam sensor (removed, but still connected, key-on). All wiring hooked up just like it is shown for no timing control. The distributor produces a points output that sinks the current from the coil, initiating the spark at the timing determined by the ECU. Doing Sniper EFI timing control with a magnetic reluctor pickup (as are found in the GM HEI) is filled with potential pitfalls, even when using the recommended MSD Pro-Billet distributor. Backfire through the tailpipe, through the intake, not cool. I attempted to set the Sniper Ignition Wiring with Holley Hyperspark Distributor and MSD Box. Used GM small Cap from DUI and have msd box. Confirm that you have the right one for your Olds engine. Problem is as I understand it that there are a few older version of the MSD in which this feature cannot be disabled and therefore cannot be used with the Sniper EFI System. it seems that the handheld wasn't just displaying '0', it was truly giving him zero timing advance at WOT (and, consequently, zero power!) Just purchased Sniper. Remember that the Terminator also has a points output just like the Sniper. If the above suggestions do not eliminiate the RF interference problem, another user I know went back to the original non-adjustable rotor. This gives me an opportunity to quote my Rule #1 for Troubleshooting EFI Engines: Avoid assuming that all problems are related to EFI. If no HyperSpark Distributor is available for your application then I recommend performing Sniper timing control with the Holley Dual Sync Distributor. On subsequent attempts it started backfiring in Time to place an order with you for a HyperSpark! While cruising if I watch close I'll see timing go to wot but tps is at say 55. I was able to recreate scenarios where the circuit was open, closed and even intermittent after pulling then reinserting the fuse. Terminator X No Start RED Crank Sensor Error. When you finally yank something and the car won't start, put it back on. Made for 24X Crank and 1X Cam the Terminator X kit controls Multec 2 Injectors with four programmable inputs and outputs, including boost and nitrous control. Some customers are struggling with RFI problems that seem to be introduced by the magnetic pickup. Price Point: $$$. It answered a little about how the system is designed to work. Is it the pickup that's different? That must be disabled if used with the Sniper EFI System or else it floods the engine with fuel before you even engage the starter. Can I use the small cap Gm HEI if I pull the timing control module out of the distributor and just use the mag pickup already in it. Or does it require the use of the CDI and associated coil?
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